[Fredje]

Hi Guys,

blew up my original battery Eliiy Power HY110 , dont ask me how, but its dead, i think the internal fuses have blown.
Now i was looking at replacments and came across some AGM battery's that fit the batterybox of a 2020 AT DCT and are a lot cheaper than the after market Lithium battery's and with the same specs as the Eliiy Power HY110, only diff is weight.

I search the forum, and only found a this old tread Replace 2018 Lithium Battery with AGM where everybody answers that you have to stay with Lipo but does not answer the question if there are people that have changed to AGM en what the result is.
And yes i know lithium is better but it is more fragile than AGM.
So my question is,
Has anybody done this and are they satisfied?
2nd question
is there any possibility to install a 2017 battery box on a newer 2020 AT?

the battery i want to use are (warning dutch site )
Nitro NTZ8V SLA / YTZ8V GEL wont fit
Nitro NTZ7S SLA / YTZ7-S GEL
or
Yuasa YTZ8V wont fit
Yuasa YTZ7S

 

[irsh]

Cheaper alternative LiPo. There are others.
Fire Power FeatherWeight Lithium Battery

Here's another thread...
Replace 2018 Lithium Battery with AGM?

 

[DoubleThumper]

I believe any respectable brand of a LiFePO4 battery is significantly more durable than any lead-acid type. I think they are less prone to catching fire than they used to be.

 

[Fredje]

Cheaper alternative LiPo. There are others.
Fire Power FeatherWeight Lithium Battery

Here's another thread...
Replace 2018 Lithium Battery with AGM?

Yes i know, there are cheap alternative's, but Lithium is very fragile in taking a beating from voltage and/or amps (depends on discharge voltage)
In the past (lead acid battery) i "forgot" some stuff like a gps, key, lichts, etc, and the battery drained, i just took my 20 year old charger that just pumps out amps instead of checking everything and revivid the battery no matter what, ok it lost some power but was good for a season or 2,
Now i left the bike in the garage for 5 weeks and lithium battery drained to 7v, put a charger on it and it does not want to charge, checked again and voltage is 0v, dismatled the battery and found out internal fuses blown, battery kaput.

don't want this happening again, so want to go for old technology that i know "AGM".

 

[Art]

Its all in the numbers

The HY110 lithum battery fitted to the CRF1100 is a 6 Ah battery rated at 120 CCA
the YTZ14S AGM battery fitted to the CRF 1000 is a 11.8 Ah battery rated at 230 CCA

Ah rating is how much current is available long term for the likes of lights, horn, ignition and fuel systems etc.
CCA is how much current is available short term at low temperatures for the starter motor to crank the engine.

The batteries you're looking at, Nitro NTZ8V SLA, Nitro YTZ8V GEL are both a 7.4 Ah battery rated at 130 CCA and Yuasa YTZ8V is a 7 Ah battery rated at 130 CCA. In terms of performance neither is any better or any worse than the HY110 lithium battery, it's a weight vs cost issue.

I'm assuming you've checked the terminal configuration and physical space available.

 

[Nomadic_adv]

The additional 20mm height on YTZ8V may be an issue over HY110.

The 18-19 CRF1000 is also fitted with lithium HY110 and going on 5 years with original HY110, no issues at all and replacing lead acid AGM batteries with lithium in other motorcycles.

There's also this (Europe) aftermarket lithium replacement option that is close to HY110 in size and spec. Lithium battery for Honda Africa Twin 1000 & 1100 from 2018 to 2022

 

[Art]

There's also this (Europe) aftermarket lithium replacement option that is close to HY110 in size and spec. Lithium battery for Honda Africa Twin 1000 & 1100 from 2018 to 2022

I wouldn't go there thats a 5 Ah battery with no specification for the CCA rating.

 

[ommoran]

Now i left the bike in the garage for 5 weeks and lithium battery drained to 7v, put a charger on it and it does not want to charge, checked again and voltage is 0v, dismatled the battery and found out internal fuses blown, battery kaput.

I believe the issue there is that you can't use your 20 year old charger. Lithium batteries require different chargers with electronic controls to prevent overcharging and blowing the fuses. Again - I believe.

I know it is counterintuitive but often a dead seeming lithium battery needs a draw for a few minutes to bring full power up - like turning on the headlight.

Lithium batteries are just very different.

 

[Kcruisin]

if there are people that have changed to AGM en what the result is.
And yes i know lithium is better but it is more fragile than AGM.
So my question is,
Has anybody done this and are they satisfied?

I'd like to know what the answer is. I've got a healthy fear of lithium batteries.
I've used only AGM batteries in my cars, bikes, and jeep for 15 years or more. I think they're the most durable battery ever made.

 

[rustynut2]

About time for a battery sticky thread I can’t keep up.

 

[Sled]

A Lithium battery isnt much dearer than a AGM

2019 Honda CRF1000L Africa Twin Parts & Accessories | MXstore

Buy 2019 CRF1000L Africa Twin Motorcycle Parts Online. Huge Range Of 2019 Honda CRF1000L Africa Twin Parts & Accessories With Free Shipping & 60 Day Returns @ MX Store

www.mxstore.com.au

$190 offers a 2yr warranty, 220 cca, design life 10yrs and the blurb says "SSB PowerSport Lithium Batteries are also one of the only Lithium Ion Batteries that can be charged using normal 12V car battery chargers / alternators"..... Although why would ya.
If I was looking I'd probably try this one.

 

[Beowulf]

When I did my hack build, on a 2021 AS, I put a fairly massive AGM battery in the trunk of the sidecar, cabled over to the bike and tied to the old battery leads. Gave the factory lithium battery to my son for his older AT.

No problems, no worries. Charges fine.

If the battery fits in the compartment, has enough capacity, you will be fine.

 

[Fredje]

Hi,
Thank you all for the replies, but i don't want a litium battery, i do want an agm and am looking for experiences in this area.
i'm a bit laks in connecting the bike to a trickle charger, i always forget and then if i want to start it with a powerpack, i don't want to be thinking, "i hope i dont blow up the litium"
Also i have around 3 lead/agm tricklechargers here, don't want to think about, for bike a i need charger z and for bike b charger y and so on, because thats a disaster waiting to happen.

The additional 20mm height on YTZ8V may be an issue over HY110.

thanks for noticing, i gave the specs in my shop for the Africa twin 2020 and it gave me those numbers, but didn't notice the hight differce.
I just checked the bike and the battery won't fit, bummer.
But i did find the YTZ7S is a better fit, and even cheaper

I believe the issue there is that you can't use your 20 year old charger. Lithium batteries require different chargers with electronic controls to prevent overcharging and blowing the fuses. Again - I believe.

I didn't, but to be honest i used a variable powersupply to load the battery and that went well the previous 2 times I did it, but the 3th time it was just to low in volts, so the fuses blew.
and thats what i mean with fragile, they need to be treated with care. i'm not the guy with silky gloves on , more the guy who takes duc-tape and a hammer to fix everything

 

[Fredje]

If the battery fits in the compartment, has enough capacity, you will be fine.

thx for the update, I also think i will be fine, and for the price €43 i could even take a spare one
I think i will buy that one and drive around with my starter battery pack in the trunk, so if it failes on route, i will hopfully get home

 

[DoubleThumper]

Hi,
Thank you all for the replies, but i don't want a litium battery, i do want an agm and am looking for experiences in this area.
i'm a bit laks in connecting the bike to a trickle charger, i always forget and then if i want to start it with a powerpack, i don't want to be thinking, "i hope i dont blow up the litium"
Also i have around 3 lead/agm tricklechargers here, don't want to think about, for bike a i need charger z and for bike b charger y and so on, because thats a disaster waiting to happen.


thanks for noticing, i gave the specs in my shop for the Africa twin 2020 and it gave me those numbers, but didn't notice the hight differce.
I just checked the bike and the battery won't fit, bummer.
But i did find the YTZ7S is a better fit, and even cheaper

I didn't, but to be honest i used a variable powersupply to load the battery and that went well the previous 2 times I did it, but the 3th time it was just to low in volts, so the fuses blew.
and thats what i mean with fragile, they need to be treated with care. i'm not the guy with silky gloves on , more the guy who takes duc-tape and a hammer to fix everything

Arguably if you can replace the fuses, you can maybe resurrect the battery to normal service.

The fuses serve to protect from a potential lithium fire.

 

[Fredje]

Arguably if you can replace the fuses, you can maybe resurrect the battery to normal service

Yes been thinking about the same, but the numbers on the fuses dont get a result in Google, and i can't seem to find what type they are.
there fuses 45A with some internal resistor in them.
its something i will be trying later down the line, when i have some time.

 

[Nomadic_adv]

If you insist on going with AGM then Yuasa YTZ7S would be the choice as I'd only only go with Yuasa for AGM powersports battery.

A Lithium battery isnt much dearer than a AGM

2019 Honda CRF1000L Africa Twin Parts & Accessories | MXstore

Buy 2019 CRF1000L Africa Twin Motorcycle Parts Online. Huge Range Of 2019 Honda CRF1000L Africa Twin Parts & Accessories With Free Shipping & 60 Day Returns @ MX Store

www.mxstore.com.au

$190 offers a 2yr warranty, 220 cca, design life 10yrs and the blurb says "SSB PowerSport Lithium Batteries are also one of the only Lithium Ion Batteries that can be charged using normal 12V car battery chargers / alternators"..... Although why would ya.
If I was looking I'd probably try this one.

Looks like it's only 4AH though? https://superstart.com.au/product/lh5l-bs/

Shorai LFX14L2-BS12 would fit 2018 + CRF1000/1100 - 210 cca and 14AH (113 x 58 x 89 mm) (HY110 112 x 70 x 110 mm)
https://www.amazon.com/Shorai-LFX14L2-BS12-Extreme-Lithium-Powersports/dp/B005FIUJ0S
For charging, Shorai states: If using a lead acid style charger, do NOT use if it has an automatic "desulfation mode", "repair", "recondition", or "recovery" mode, which cannot be turned off. Lead acid charger/tenders can be used for regular maintenance charging and then be disconnected after the battery is fully charged. DO NOT leave the lead acid charger connected to store the battery, because most will NOT maintain the proper voltage for lithium batteries. IMPORTANT- if the LFX battery is deeply discharged below 12.86V only a lithium charger with cell balancing can be used to recover the battery.

 

[ommoran]

I will say up front: I mean no disrespect to anyone participating in this discussion. This is my opinion only.

It seems to me that there is a significant amount of "Who Moved My Cheese" going on in this thread. Lithium batteries with their integrated electronic sensors and monitors represent a significant leap forward in materials and technology in comparison to their AGM counterparts. The resulting decrease in size and weight, and increase in performance, all benefit any vehicle, but motorcycles especially.

The fact that the new batteries have to be treated differently and also have different requirements and equipment are just evolutions in technology. You had to discard your parallel port printer at some point in order to use a much faster USB interface connected to a much faster printer - and now, your printer sits so long that the ink dries out, as everything is sent electronically now, including signatures. Technology facilitates increased performance and speed, at a cost of the obsolescence of that which it replaces.

I don't know if the OP did any research on the care and feeding of lithium batteries before he connected a charger to it. When I found out that my AT was coming with a lithium battery - and probably before, when I was looking to put one on my 2011 V-Strom - I learned that a "dead" lithium battery often just requires a small draw in order to come back to life, such as turning on the headlight for a few minutes. As posted above in the post about the Shorai battery:

IMPORTANT- if the LFX battery is deeply discharged below 12.86V only a lithium charger with cell balancing can be used to recover the battery.

I really do think that this whole discussion requires a shift in understanding of the new technology, and not thinking that "a battery is a battery". Lithium batteries are not without their faults, but I don't think they are more fragile than their lead counterparts. I truly think that they aren't as well understood, even though we all rely on lithium batteries every day in countless devices, including our phones and laptops, right up through EVs.

Again, I mean no offense. Let the hate mail begin.

 

[ViperTech18]

Yes been thinking about the same, but the numbers on the fuses dont get a result in Google, and i can't seem to find what type they are.
there fuses 45A with some internal resistor in them.
its something i will be trying later down the line, when i have some time.

Check This:

 

[Trek Moto]

If you insist on going with AGM then Yuasa YTZ7S would be the choice as I'd only only go with Yuasa for AGM powersports battery.

I agree with the Yuasa recommendation but I doubt a YTZ7S will be enough battery for a 1000cc bike. The YTZ7S is typically found in sub-500cc bikes. At the least I'd recommend a YTZ10S.

https://www.yuasabatteries.com/battery/ytz10s/