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Discussion Starter #1
I would like to keep this thread purely about the powercommander rather than other methods of attempting to solve the problem (please )
I've done a search of all the subforums on here and it doesn't look like anyone has actually fitted a powercommander yet - if anyone has please shout up and tell us whether it works.
I am talking to Dynojet about fitting one to a 2018 model year bike. They say that they haven't got the kit out yet for the 2018 (but by implication it has been available for the earlier model).
They are also suggesting that for the DCT (because it can't be put on a rolling road dyno) the solution will be a powercommander 5 plus their autotune module. This is an expensive solution at over £500 but the Africa Twin is such a brilliant bike that it may be worth it if it solves the one imperfection for me (well the heated grips, and the crap outside air temp guage are a nuisance as well :grin2:)
Whilst browsing their website I have come across what appears to be dynojet's equivalent of the RapidBikeEasy (which didn;t work for me). It's not listed yet as being available for the Africa Twin but I've asked them. Since it's just described as a fuel controller it may be more what we are after if all we are trying to do is solve Euro lean fuelling issues. http://www.powercommander.com/powercommander/products/PCFC/powercommander_pcfc.aspx
Mike
PS - I'm also exploring how insurance companies view these products and for this purpose (imroving low rev fuelling) it seems they are quite accommodating - but will report back
 

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Thanks Mike, will follow this out of interest. But I don't find that my AT has any low speed issues, even in London traffic. Are the manual versions better on this point maybe? If anything, I find the AT better than my Varadero who had to be in first gear at anything under 20mph lol.
As for the fuelling, I can't imagine it burning more fuel right now or else I'd only get 100 miles out of a tank!
 

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Discussion Starter #3
Thanks Mike, will follow this out of interest. But I don't find that my AT has any low speed issues, even in London traffic. Are the manual versions better on this point maybe? If anything, I find the AT better than my Varadero who had to be in first gear at anything under 20mph lol.
As for the fuelling, I can't imagine it burning more fuel right now or else I'd only get 100 miles out of a tank!
Well my other attempts to cure the lean fuelling (rapidBikeEasy and Hilltop's ECU remap) made no difference to the fuel consumption at all. This in itself made me suspect that they were not affecting the fuel ratio. But I had a great experience with powercommander 10 years ago solving the issue on a Versys.
But can I ask again that this thread is kept purely about the powercommander rather than whether people have or haven't got an opinion on whether their bike stutters/snatches/surges etc. as there are plenty of other threads about the problem.
Mike
PS - at the risk of not following my own advice - I don't think the AT is bad for this, I've ridden much worse bikes.
 

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Discussion Starter #4
Just received this from Dynojet (to pass on to my insurers). The claims that the MD makes for the product in the paragraph below, were completely justified when I used it on my Versys, and it made it a pure pleasure to ride instead of (occasionally) really irritating.
Mike
To Whom It May Concern:
The Power Commander is a product which fits in line with the OEM engine management.
It allows us to 3 dimensionally re-fuel the Motorcycle. In doing so the noticeable
difference to the rider is a smoother power delivery, no snatchiness at low throttle
openings, and more progressive and predictable acceleration. This ultimately makes the
Bike easier and more pleasurable to ride, more predictable and in some cases safer (a
snatchy throttle on slippery roads can be exceedingly dangerous. It must be noted that in
some cases small Horsepower gains may be made at peak power (usually less than 3%).
It is important not to mistake the Power Commander with “chips” or “chipping” on cars
where on Turbo cars the power can be significantly raised by raising the boost pressure of
the car.
Frank Wrathall
Managing Director
Dynojet UK Ltd
 

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I have a PCV in my cart for just this reason, but am hesitant to pull the trigger without more info. A fuel controller from Dynojet is in the works- and should be cheaper, to accomplish a similar goal, but the descriptions on the website just make it sound like it does the same thing, but less.

My only nagging issue with the AT is snatching throttle in stop and go traffic. I would love to hear a positive outcome with another PCV user on this.

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Discussion Starter #6
Further update direct from Dynojet in the UK.
Long telephone conversation with their guy Richard who rang me. Apparently they have done quite a few AT's already but all the owners must be on ADV-rider rather than on here.
BUT - he says the 2018 bike is different. The 16/17 bikes could use a simple o2 eliminator but they are waiting for an o2 optimiser to be finished and delivered from the States which is essential before the powercommander will work with the 2018 onwards bikes..
They are busy producing a map that will work with the Powercomannder 5 plus this optimiser and when they know what bike it's for they will put that map in the Pc5 before it's sent out. That way he reckons we won't need a rolling road or to spend money on their autotune module.
Mike
 

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You can put the DCT on a rolling road dyno, you just have to be a bit creative & Im surprised Power Commander or any of the other tuning module companies hadn't thought of it.
All you need to do is purchase a spare ABS wheel sensor, unplug the front wheel sensor, plug in the spare sensor & temporary mount it to the rear wheel, by doing this the bike thinks the front wheel is spinning & the bike should work as normal
 

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Discussion Starter #8
You can put the DCT on a rolling road dyno, you just have to be a bit creative & Im surprised Power Commander or any of the other tuning module companies hadn't thought of it.
All you need to do is purchase a spare ABS wheel sensor, unplug the front wheel sensor, plug in the spare sensor & temporary mount it to the rear wheel, by doing this the bike thinks the front wheel is spinning & the bike should work as normal
Yes Dynojet said they'd heard about some shops doing something similar.
Mike
 

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Discussion Starter #10
RevZilla says the PC5 is compatible with the 2018 ASA. So that isn't accurate, I take it?

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Not necessarily untrue I guess. European bikes have to comply with different rules from those in the USA so it's possible that a PC5 works with a 2018 non-euro bike. However, the way Dynojet in the UK described the O2 sensor and OEM software working on 2018 bikes sounds like something that would be on all the bikes rather than just some, so it's possibly an error on Revzilla's part.
Mike
 

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why not get a proper module like a rapid bike? No problems with euro or not euro bikes ,work way better than a PC5 .
Pc5 is the past (also soon they will start to sell the power vision for more models)
 

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why not get a proper module like a rapid bike? No problems with euro or not euro bikes ,work way better than a PC5 .

Pc5 is the past (also soon they will start to sell the power vision for more models)
Probably because the topic poster said this is a discussion about power commander.

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Discussion Starter #15
Here's an insurance update for any UK guys. My insurer wants a 20% premium loading for basic powercommander. I decided to run a comparison site and 3 separate individual insurers with and without a powercommander and all except one wanted between £50 and £60 extra per year. I suspect that the one that didn't want any extra (MCE) was after new business at any cost because they were about £200 cheaper than anyone else. Either that or after buying, the paperwork would have conveniently for them missed off the modifications.
This is a large ongoing cost that needs to be factored in to the purchase price of a powercommander. However, I suspect that it's not just Powercommander but ANY engine modification device (Rapid Bike, boosterplug etc). If you don't declare it, you run the risk of a claim being denied and they are pretty obvious to any insurance assessor - unlike an ecu remap if that works for you.
I have told my insurer that they are probably overpenalising most people fitting these devices these days as we are fitting them not to increase performance but to make the bike more comfortable. But I am one lone voice :)
Mike
 

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Probably because the topic poster said this is a discussion about power commander.

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That´s why i wrote rapid Bike , not so difficult to understand 0:)
better product , better software , lot of settings , not need an autotune as it´s already included .
Plus as i already wrote there are no problems to dyno honda bikes with DCT.
 

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That´s why i wrote rapid Bike , not so difficult to understand 0:)
better product , better software , lot of settings , not need an autotune as it´s already included .
Plus as i already wrote there are no problems to dyno honda bikes with DCT.
I'm personally interested in it. It's just the OP asked that the discussion be limited to discussion about Power Commander. Unless Rapid Bike is another product from Dynajet- **** if I know.

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Discussion Starter #18
That´s why i wrote rapid Bike , not so difficult to understand /forum/images/AfricaTwinForum/smilies/tango_face_angel.png
better product , better software , lot of settings , not need an autotune as it´s already included .
Plus as i already wrote there are no problems to dyno honda bikes with DCT.
I'm personally interested in it. It's just the OP asked that the discussion be limited to discussion about Power Commander. Unless Rapid Bike is another product from Dynajet- **** if I know.

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I’ve been resisting replying to this as it will almost certainly turn into a debate about why one is better than the other but no RapidBike is not from Dynajet (makers of the powercommander) and FWIW my experience is that a RapidBike product made no difference when I tried it last year whereas a powercommander 10 years ago solved a similar problem so I’d like to find out if anyone has experience of the powercommander and if not I will probably take the plunge and report back on here then people have another information source when deciding what to buy
Mike
(And I should emphasise that the RapidBikeEasy which I tried is very ‘cheap’ and a more expensive RapidBike product may well work)
 

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Rapidbike easy it´s simple a O2 sensor emulator .
You have to compare the EVO to the PC5
If i tell you about this product is not because i´m selling them but cause as owner of 49 bikes i have and had lot of PC5 and PC3 units and few rapid bike aswel .
There is no debate at all , rapid bike evo and racing are for sale since 1 year before dynojet .
Faced with the problem PC5 corrently have , unable to sell product who is working on close loop area (that´s for most of new euro4 hondas)
Adding :rapid bike gonna use the O2 sensor for auto-adaptive feature , sort of autotune of dynojet but already included in the module (no extra 325$ expense )

Wanna hear about PC5 experiences with euro4 ?
Dynojet was unable to fix the problem in closed loop so i bought a rapid bike like i did for my Cb1000r+.
But sure hey , here all are professional involved with bikes since 30 years...



P.s. also it´s dynojet with O not dynajet ...
 

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Rapidbike easy it´s simple a O2 sensor emulator .
You have to compare the EVO to the PC5
If i tell you about this product is not because i´m selling them but cause as owner of 49 bikes i have and had lot of PC5 and PC3 units and few rapid bike aswel .
There is no debate at all , rapid bike evo and racing are for sale since 1 year before dynojet .
Faced with the problem PC5 corrently have , unable to sell product who is working on close loop area (that´s for most of new euro4 hondas)
Adding :rapid bike gonna use the O2 sensor for auto-adaptive feature , sort of autotune of dynojet but already included in the module (no extra 325$ expense )

Wanna hear about PC5 experiences with euro4 ?
Dynojet was unable to fix the problem in closed loop so i bought a rapid bike like i did for my Cb1000r+.
But sure hey , here all are professional involved with bikes since 30 years...



P.s. also it´s dynojet with O not dynajet ...
+ Infinity

I have the Evo installed as well with a full system and I have not experienced ANY rough idling or back firing.

I know the EVO is a bit pricey, and you know I hate forking out $$$, but the EVO is worth it.
 
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