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Discussion Starter #1
Hi guys,


I'm a long time ST1300 rider and use it for commuting (secondary) but more important going on riding trips with my wife. Recently my trusty and reliable ST1300 has been in an accident and thus I am looking to replace it with something. The used prices for ST1300s in my area are ridiculous to the point that a 9 year old ST with 80K on the clock goes for nearly the cost of a new Africa Twin out the door.


At this point we're looking at the FJR1300, Super Tenere, Africa Twin, VFR1200, Vstrom and Fazer 900 GT (not in any order.)



Anyone here in a similar boat going from an ST1300 to the Africa twin and touring with a passenger? What are the things they complain about for comfort?


At this time, the Africa twin is very well priced for us in comparison to everything else we are looking at. The Africa twin seems like it can carry more than the ST as well it seems depending on if you get the Adventure Sports model or not.


Thank you for any feedback.
 

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Discussion Starter #2
I forgot to mention, the only offroading I'll be doing on the Africa Twin is the same offroading I do with my wife on the ST1300.

Gravel and dirt roads to get to a destination, but no offroading as part of the intended adventure or taking off road trails when paved paths exist.
 

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Hi. I'm not coming directly from an ST1300 to the AT, but I've owned 2 ST's (2003 & 2007). I used them for Iron Butt certification rides and two up a lot with my wife. I also owned a Concourse 1400. Didn't use it for Iron Butt riding, but it was good for scaring the bejeebers out of myself.

You will not get the power from the AT that you're accustomed to, but I've not ridden the AT 2 up. Nor do I intend to. I plan to use it primarily for both on and off road rides around Colorado. I'm sure it will haul two up with gear, but it won't be effortless like the ST. Power is substantial for what it'd designed to do, and as far as I'm concerned, the AT is more comfortable for me with the upright riding position. My legs don't get as cramped up long distance as they did on both ST's and the Conny.

Wind protection is nowhere near what you're used to, but can be fixed fairly cheaply with an aftermarket screen.

One more observation that might be of use to you is that, although the larger front wheel on the AT is great in the dirt, it doesn't do as good in the twisties. Still fun to crank through those in the mountains, but it won't turn in to a curve as smoothly or quickly as the sport tourers.

Hope this helps.
 

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Discussion Starter #5
You will not get the power from the AT that you're accustomed to, but I've not ridden the AT 2 up.

The ST1300 looks to have about 10% more power based on specs, but this can be deceiving as it is hard to tell if this is because the ST1300 pretty much has power everywhere and if the AT will be about the same. Fully loaded, the ST1300 pulls no different than without being loaded, you'll notice it in the handling but I'm not really riding aggressive or anything like that. The AT is significantly lighter giving up like 200lbs of weight IIRC over the ST1300.


My legs don't get as cramped up long distance as they did on both ST's and the Conny.

This sounds like heaven to me. With the seat on the highest setting on the ST1300 my legs do cramp up and I often find myself wishing for more leg room. If this is an improvement then I'll be pretty happy.



Wind protection is nowhere near what you're used to, but can be fixed fairly cheaply with an aftermarket screen.

I'd prefer less wind protection than what the ST1300 gives me. My only concern with the AT would be getting more turbulence or buffeting than what I am used to.



One more observation that might be of use to you is that, although the larger front wheel on the AT is great in the dirt, it doesn't do as good in the twisties. Still fun to crank through those in the mountains, but it won't turn in to a curve as smoothly or quickly as the sport tourers.

I've heard this mentioned before, and I always wonder how much of an impact this would be for how I actually ride. If this looks like it is the route I am going to take I'll just need to identify if that is going to be an issue when I test ride it. Most serious riding I do is 2-up so the speed is generally more relaxed than some.


Thanks, this was helpful and has highlighted a few more things that I need to think about.
 

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VFR1200X Crosstourer?
I've never owned one, but I have had a few rides. They are typical Honda: smooth, refined and linear, so much so that you think it's kind of vanilla until you realise what speed you are actually doing, and how quickly it got you there. I think it also comes in a DCT version. Shaft drive too. With some TKC70s you'd have a great tourer with some light adv ride capability thrown in with about +40 hp over the AT. Might be worth considering.
 

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I went from an St to an ATAS. My buddy and I swap back and forth often with his ST. My ATAS is quieter with less buffeting, has less wind protection for the lower body, and gets about the same mileage. I doubt it is very comfortable for a pillion. You will miss the power of the ST. I think the AT is not well suited for your needs but I'd sure take a hard look at the VFR1200X. You will want an aux tank immediately but I think it would be much better for 2 up.
 

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I am coming directly from a ST1300. I traded a month ago for my 18 AT AS. I havn't missed the ST1300 one bit. The biggest problem with my ST1300 was the heat! I am 6'5" and the AT AS is far more comfortable to me. I get better fuel econ on the AT AS (almost 300 miles per tank, avg around 45mpg) I averaged about 39-40 mpg on my ST. The only thing I do miss from the ST1300 was the panniers, and fairing storage. As soon as I get panniers for the AT AS I probably wont give the ST a second thought. It was a good bike, but for me the AT AS is way better all the way around.

I was a member over on St-owners.com before I am here. I used the same UID and Avatar over there.
 

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I'm not sure the AT is a real two-up bike. You should see if you can find a test ride with your wife. I take my son on mine and there's not a lot of extra room for the passenger if you use luggage/top box. Other than that it is an absolutely awesome bike in every way. I used to ride a VFR (ten years) and had a few other dual sport bikes before the AT. Once you realize the capabilities of the bike you'll spend more and more time riding gravel and trails - it's that easy to ride and that good at them.

I have buddies with Vstroms and I've ridden them. It's the closest to sport touring of your lists, comfy, reliable and fun to ride, and does really well on gravel and more (much more if you're willing to push it).

The VFR1200X has a v-four like your ST1300. It's really a great bike, plenty of room for a pillion, shaft drive and goes like the wind. If I wanted to only occasionally ride gravel and mostly tour with a passenger - that'd be the bike I'd pick. I've ridden the DCT version on a test ride - it's smooth and quick.
 

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I use a ST1300 for Blood Running, owned a VRF1200X for 4 years and trding it in for a new ATAS


They all have their different pros and cons


I hope I dont find too many cons on the new ATAS, but the 1200x had too many in the end


The ST1300 does most things very well
 

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"" The used prices for ST1300s in my area are ridiculous to the point that a 9 year old ST with 80K on the clock goes for nearly the cost of a new Africa Twin out the door.""


Jaysus ! where do you live ?
 

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Just for giggles, I took my wife out on the AT for about 20 miles tonight. Not much of a test, but several things came up during the ride...

There isn't nearly the room for the passenger as there is on the ST. My wife is 5'3", 115 lbs. She didn't like being tucked right up against me or back on the rack.

The AT does not have the pulling power of the ST when 2 up. It has plenty of power, but we ride the mountains a lot (not today) and I believe we'd be a little down on the ability that the ST had.

In all, my wife liked the ST better, but didn't dislike the AT. Her words... "This one's all yours. I'll stick with the back of the Harley." When I asked her about comfort between the AT and the ST she said she liked the suspension on the AT better, but didn't like the lack of room for "her own space" on the AT.

So, there's all that. Take it for what it's worth, but she's been on the back of almost all my bikes for the last 36 years and has a lot of miles under her butt. Full disclosure: She was spoiled for many years with her Barco Lounger seat on my Electra Glides.

Again, I'm not knocking the AT, I love it for what it does for me and for the riding I do on it. That riding is going to be about 60% pavement and 40% off road. I just don't think, **** I know I wouldn't want to use it for LD 2 UP. It's my bike. All mine. With no chatter from the back seat. :)
 

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Suspensions will be more comfortable than the ST1300. I tried a FJR1300 and great bike, but the kind of inline 4, that unless youre on cruise control all the time, its hard not to ride way above speed limits. Also at 6'1" wasnt the most comfortable bike for me.


I think for what you want to do, I'd give the Tenere 1200 ES a try. That electronic suspension is really awesome. In comfort mode, it will soak up the worst of roads no problem, and you can still stiffen it up to have fun in the twisties. Upright position, very roomy. Drive shaft, cruise control, heated grips, etc.


The only thing that prevented me from buying one was the engine. Its got plenty go, but just a bit boring. The Africa has less power, but it still power wheelies in 1st gear and even 2nd gear if you shut the throttle and re-open. Feels lighter than it's 500lbs would suggest but it doesnt have cruise control, or heated grips, or electronic suspensions... Overall my gf 120lbs, 5'4" loves it. But I still think if the main objective is 2 up touring, a Tenere 1200 ES would be my pick, any day.
 

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"" The used prices for ST1300s in my area are ridiculous to the point that a 9 year old ST with 80K on the clock goes for nearly the cost of a new Africa Twin out the door.""


Jaysus ! where do you live ?
For real! IN the states, I find them all day long for less than $5k well outfitted and low miles.
 

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I ride two up on my AT. I put the comfort foot pegs on forthe passenger and have a Schad top box. My wife loves it! She likes that the passengerseat is in a higher position which gives her better visibility.










Hi guys,


I'm a long time ST1300 rider and use it for commuting (secondary) but more important going on riding trips with my wife. Recently my trusty and reliable ST1300 has been in an accident and thus I am looking to replace it with something. The used prices for ST1300s in my area are ridiculous to the point that a 9 year old ST with 80K on the clock goes for nearly the cost of a new Africa Twin out the door.


At this point we're looking at the FJR1300, Super Tenere, Africa Twin, VFR1200, Vstrom and Fazer 900 GT (not in any order.)



Anyone here in a similar boat going from an ST1300 to the Africa twin and touring with a passenger? What are the things they complain about for comfort?


At this time, the Africa twin is very well priced for us in comparison to everything else we are looking at. The Africa twin seems like it can carry more than the ST as well it seems depending on if you get the Adventure Sports model or not.


Thank you for any feedback.
 

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Gonna jump into the fray here. I love my 17 manual AT and am a big advocate of the bike. That said based on what I'm reading have you considered the new 2020 BMW R 1250 RS (Sport Tourer)? That thing looks cool. I'm interested in it to the point I'm even going to arrange a test ride. I'd still keep my AT of course if I took the plunge......
 

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Discussion Starter #17
I use a ST1300 for Blood Running, owned a VRF1200X for 4 years and trding it in for a new ATAS

I hope I dont find too many cons on the new ATAS, but the 1200x had too many in the end
What were some of the things that you didn't like on the VFR1200X? I've added that and the versys 1000 to the list so far.
 

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Discussion Starter #18
I'm avoiding Ducati and BMW based on some the reliability reports that I've read.


I've ridden the Ducati ST3 (very nice) and drooled over the Multi Strada.
 

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What were some of the things that you didn't like on the VFR1200X? I've added that and the versys 1000 to the list so far.

Its the torque grunt I loved, fantastic


But its very heavy to push around on the ground


Did not like suspension, changed it, better but not smooth, pillion complains.


Its a bit clunky too, not a mice smooth bike. Some vibes through the bars too


It have had it 4 years and 30000 miles, just got a good deal to trade
 
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