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2020 ATAS ES DCT and a few more
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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
As luck would have it, right after I sold my 2018 ATAS ES DCT, I found out we don't have to relocate, at least not anytime soon and not to the west coast where I would have had to deal with a tiny garage. On the plus side, I did ok selling my ATAS. So now I am on the fence of what to buy.

Has anyone who bought the 2020 ATAS ES DCT, previously owned 2018/2019 version of the same bike? Can you provide some feedback about what you like or don't like about the newer version? I had thought about buying the 2020 when it came out but the dealer made an incredibly insulting offer on mine on trade and didn't entertain that idea any further. Now I am in a cleaner situation and with the 2021's likely hitting the floor pretty soon, I could maybe pickup a leftover 2020 at a decent price.

Some of the things I didn't like about my 2018 were; no electronic cruise, tubed tires, and needed more HP. It seems like the 2020 addresses those main items and adds in electronic suspension, which if done right, can be a big plus like on some of my other bikes. The addition of Apple Car play would be a great improvement for me too.

So any feedback that might be helpful? If I had an idea of the time horizon regarding a possible supercharged AT version, I'd would be willing to wait if it was in the next year or so but I doubt it will be that soon but you never know.
 

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May I ask, what does "ES" stand for? I've seen that designation on a 2020 model but, not ever before on an '18 AT/AS/DCT or otherwise. I'd not done much research on the model identification but, on the 2020 AT/AS, is has ELECTRONIC SUSPENSION that is adjustable on the fly. So, I thought that's what the ES stands for on a '20 version. But, the '18's don't have that. So, just wondering what the ES stands for on an '18, especially since this is the first time someone's used that ES on an '18, that I've seen. As for your demands of higher HP, well, to my understanding, the '20 is really only about 6 more HP than an '18 but, I've got no real data to support that. It's only what the dealers told me when I was looking at my '18.

AS for cruise control, well, I bought my '18 for $10,900 brand new about 8 months ago. A brand new 2020 AT/AS/DCT, sitting right next to mine, was $18,000.00. Soooo, I saved around $6,500 - $7,000 but, the bikes are very, very close to the same bike. Yes, there are some advances in the '20 but, $6,500 worth? Not in my book. I added the McCruise for $525, a Camel products Kick stand for $119.00 and even a $520.00 Garmin Zumo XT and I'm still, $5,800.00 ahead, in my book and, I've got a wonderful, fast enough for me, totally flawless bike. About the only thing I'm thinking I'll finally add is the Smart Turn signal system, that is a self canceling turn signal system that the '20's and earlier European versions have, that the '18 USA versions don't. A "Supercharged" AT, man, why don't ya just by a Hayabusa and be done with it?
Scott
 

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You’re correct about the 6 or 7 hp increase. However, all motorcycle journalists say that the difference in the motors are night and day. No doubt a result of recalibratEd electronics.
 

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It's true, 6% extra or what ever they say does equate to what seems a lot more at "your backside" horsepower compared to the 1000 engine, compared to my 16 bike the new one is streets ahead, also you have the added bonus of switching to power level 4 (lowest) to make it feel like the old bike 😄
 

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You’re correct about the 6 or 7 hp increase. However, all motorcycle journalists say that the difference in the motors are night and day. No doubt a result of recalibratEd electronics.
well I didn't notice any difference between the 1100 and my 2019 1000cc. I wonder whether the journalists are comparing it with the 2016/17 engine which is hugely more boring to ride than the RBW which came in late 2018.
Mike
 

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2020 ATAS ES DCT and a few more
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Discussion Starter · #6 ·
@FIRE UP - I get all those arguments but there is a crucial one you left out, the tubeless wheels. I had 5 flats in the first 2500 miles. I had one of those in the first 500 miles and and the 2nd within the first 1000 miles. Of my 5, 2 were on the front tire and one of those was at high speed 80+ in a turn. Let me just say, I forgot how pucker clenching losing your front tire in the middle of a turn can be. By comparison, I probably didn't have 5 flats in the last 10 years of riding on my other bikes put together. All they needed was a simple repair kit to get me back on the road. The AT is a royal PITA to change, lack of centerstand makes it even worse.

As for Garmin MC GPS, I have 2 of those on my BMWs. They do give insight into the bike so there are better than most because they are so well integrated. It is still a pain to port all my info over to it compared to just firing up my phone with Waze. I take advantage of the traffic and police alerts all the time and they seem to be much better done on Waze than I've ever seen on Garmin or TomTom or pretty much anyone else for that matter. There is a reason Google bought Waze and is slowing pulling its features into Google maps. Also one less thing to take off the bike when I get off. Even though I have a locking mount on one BMW and the other is almost impossible to take off with the windshield in its down position, doesn't mean people haven't tried.

Another nice feature on the 2020 is the DCT trans is now integrated with the IMU. This makes the shifting and traction control more intelligent. Definitely a good thing in my book. As for the extra power, it all depends on how/where you ride. I am a bigger guy, so a 1000cc bike feels more like an 800cc bike that it would someone lighter. Factor in some mountains, luggage/passenger and then higher altitude and it can feel like you are riding a weak 500 or smaller. It was already pretty much the weakest of the 1000's anyway. Don't forget, for every 1000' increase in altitude, you lose 3% of your power. I'll take the extra 6-7% that the new one has as a starting point.

That is why the supercharged one would be even more interesting to me. Forced induction motors lose more HP as a result of altitude. I have a supercharged Kawasaki, and while it loses power in the mountains, it doesn't at the same rate as a normally aspirated bike would.

I ran my AT a few times with the Dragy GPS and app which does a great job of tracking my acceleration times, and very close to what I see at the track. Usually, I am within a few hundredths for time and less than .25 mph off what I would see when I run a bike at the track. The advantage is, I don't have to go to the track to get an accurate measurement. Best run of 4 that day, was [email protected] mph. Which corrected for density altitude would [email protected] mph. That was with TC in 1 (least intrusive but still own) and power set to max. I was in S3 mode (most aggressive on the DCT). It pretty much shifted close to redline every time. All my runs were within .15 seconds of each other. It would make an amazing bracket racer at at 13.0 dial in. That was just me, 1/2 tank of fuel, no luggage. Again I am big person so I am slowing it down a bit but as you can see, it isn't exactly fleet of foot and I was just a little bit above sea level. By comparison, the last 1000cc V-strom I had clicked off 12.2-12.3 with the bags on. I am sure the DCT costs the motor a bit but it makes up for it with consistency.

I didn't buy my AT originally to be a hypersports bike, I have a few of those. I enjoy it a lot as a daily driver so to speak and would like a bit more punch. From what I read, it might be close to what I am looking for. I demo rode 2020 but not for long enough, and in a confined city environment. It was new and I didn't want to beat on it, but it generally felt snappier when I'd get on the throttle. Sort of like the difference between riding in hot summer weather when the bike feels sluggish and early spring where it seems a lot more eager.

So if I try and make the earlier version into something like the 2020 such as If I were to go with a set of wheels designed for tubeless tires, that is several thousand more. If I sell the bike, I won't get squat out of them on it, so I'd have to take them off and hope someone would want them. I learned a long time ago, add farkles is just pssing money done the drain at resale time. So I'd rather get close to what I want ultimately upfront, but doing with the basic bike itself rather than adding on few things.

At full retail though for a 2020, I'll probably go back to a 2018/19. Since the new gen came out it crushed their value. However, I found a used 2020 DCT AS, about a month old with 500 miles on it. No inflated dealer fees as it is a private party. He is asking 15,500 for it. I think he'd take 15k for it. It turned out to be too tall for him and he doesn't feel comfortable riding it. Almost dropped it twice he said. So at that price point, it makes it a great option to consider as the delta is a lot narrower and all the upgrades are easily worth 4k to me. So might buy it and ride it until the supercharged version finally drops. ;-)
 

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As luck would have it, right after I sold my 2018 ATAS ES DCT, I found out we don't have to relocate, at least not anytime soon and not to the west coast where I would have had to deal with a tiny garage. On the plus side, I did ok selling my ATAS. So now I am on the fence of what to buy.

Has anyone who bought the 2020 ATAS ES DCT, previously owned 2018/2019 version of the same bike? Can you provide some feedback about what you like or don't like about the newer version? I had thought about buying the 2020 when it came out but the dealer made an incredibly insulting offer on mine on trade and didn't entertain that idea any further. Now I am in a cleaner situation and with the 2021's likely hitting the floor pretty soon, I could maybe pickup a leftover 2020 at a decent price.

Some of the things I didn't like about my 2018 were; no electronic cruise, tubed tires, and needed more HP. It seems like the 2020 addresses those main items and adds in electronic suspension, which if done right, can be a big plus like on some of my other bikes. The addition of Apple Car play would be a great improvement for me too.

So any feedback that might be helpful? If I had an idea of the time horizon regarding a possible supercharged AT version, I'd would be willing to wait if it was in the next year or so but I doubt it will be that soon but you never know.

Hi
I was riding a normal 2019 DCT version and upgraded after a year to a 2020 ATAS ES DCT. My 2019 was a great bike but the 2020 ATAS is on a different level. The engine, suspension and riding position are a different league. Also the extras like heated grips, cruise control, appel car play.... just puts it into another class . On both bikes I had the rear brake moved to the left hand and can ride the bike with hand controls only.... great off-road...

regards
robb
 

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You can always wait and get something better a year later. Well, sometimes, sounds like the 2021 will be same as the 2020. Also, "waiting" for a specific feature like SuperCharging may never happen. I've been through this before, with motorbikes and computers. I'm now at the point where I either buy it cause I want / like it or don't. In this case, I'm not buying till Spring because our riding season here is pretty well done and I don't fancy buying a bike and having it sit in the garage for 5 months while I'm making payments.
 

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Hi
I was riding a normal 2019 DCT version and upgraded after a year to a 2020 ATAS ES DCT. My 2019 was a great bike but the 2020 ATAS is on a different level. The engine, suspension and riding position are a different league. Also the extras like heated grips, cruise control, appel car play.... just puts it into another class . On both bikes I had the rear brake moved to the left hand and can ride the bike with hand controls only.... great off-road...

regards
robb
Welcome to the Forum Robb. Was your 2019 at standard AT or ATAS? Going from an AT to an ATAS would feel different. Going from a 2019 to a 2020 would also feel different based just on the frame redesign alone.

Congrats on your new 2020 ATAS!
 

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Just wondering, what does "ES* stand for on the '20 version AT?
Scott
 

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Just wondering, what does "ES* stand for on the '20 version AT?
Scott
I think in the OP, it was incorrectly applied to the previously owned 18/19 models. Afaik, it only applies to '20 and newer.
 

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Electronic suspension.
Ya know, that's what I kind-a thought. But, I tried to research on line, just about anything that pertained to a 2020 AT/AS/ES and, for the life of me, I can't find ANYTHING that simply states what it is, or why Honda pastes it on that model. Thanks for answering me.
Scott

I think in the OP, it was incorrectly applied to the previously owned 18/19 models. Afaik, it only applies to '20 and newer.
Well, that's kind-a what I thought too since, I'd really only seen that designation on a '20. But, I am by far, no expert and I also thought that, maybe, just maybe, there might have been a few models of the AT/AS out there in 2018, that also sported that designation. But, I don't think so. Thanks.
Scott
 

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I think in the OP, it was incorrectly applied to the previously owned 18/19 models. Afaik, it only applies to '20 and newer.
That is my understanding too. The added servos to drive the suspension ride is a rather non-trivial convenience feature and I suspect contributes princely to the 2020 ATAS price premium.
 

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Hi
I was riding a normal 2019 DCT version and upgraded after a year to a 2020 ATAS ES DCT. My 2019 was a great bike but the 2020 ATAS is on a different level. The engine, suspension and riding position are a different league. Also the extras like heated grips, cruise control, appel car play.... just puts it into another class . On both bikes I had the rear brake moved to the left hand and can ride the bike with hand controls only.... great off-road...

regards
robb
I don’ see how the 2020 model could be more comfortable. Never had a bike so comfy. Wouldn’t have a clue what to adjust on mine. Just perfect. (Okay had a ducati before)
 

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Turned 70 in Sept, I've been driving (more or less) continuously since 1971.. lots of different bikes and a couple of mega trips including one attempt at Tierra Del Fuego in 79-80 (long story). Started on a 69 Honda 450, then a 750 but since its been mostly Beemers but there were a couple of FJRs, KLRs and one WR in between. So two weeks back I cracked and signed for a brand new nicely discounted 2020 ATAS ES (in black). Driving from the dealership it only took me about 10 minutes to conclude that this is just the finest **** motorcycle I have ever ridden. Pardon the superlatives but.. its like riding on the back of a panther. Sure footed thanks to frame and ES, torquey and able to leap powerfully from 2500 RPM, and an almost organic feel thanks to the suspension. Shifting modes (Tour, Urban, Gravel, User) seems almost a different bike. And IMHO its a beautiful bike with classical lines. My wife loves the ride (only other bike she liked was the KLR) and says it sounds sexy - I agree. Not driven the 19 model but many reviewers point out that they are very different bikes. Go with the 20/21!
 
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