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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
So, tubed tyres are easier to break the bead seal than tubeless tyres……
2019 AT , so, I feel happy enough if faced with a flat away from home, using a pair of motion pro levers.
But, my replacement Bridgestone Battleaxe tyre is a tubeless version going onto a tubed rim ( with tube) …….
Question…. Is this tubeless tyre going to stick to the rim to the extent that I cant break the bead ?
looking forward to your replies guys!
 

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You can use tubeless tires with a tube, not a problem. Running a tube-type only tire tubeless is a no-no though, so you're fine. Mount it up, and go pop some wheelies!
 

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Soooooo,
Let me get this straight. Many on here have gone through the effort(s) of sealing off spoke ends to convert, a tube type wheel and tire, to a tubeless one, correct? And when that process is complete, you can now install, a TUBELESS tire on that sealed rim, correct? Soooo, with all that being said, I'm going to assume, that:

1. The sealing bead of a tube type rim, is either exactly like, or very close to, the sealing bead on a factory tubeless rim, correct?
2. There should be no issues, installing a tubeless tire, on a factory tube type rim, WITHOUT a tube, correct? I mean, what's the point of doing the work of sealing a rim, and then put a tube back in it?
3. And, if one installs a tubeless tire on a sealed rim, and has been in service for a general life time of the tire, is there any issues in breaking the bead loose, to install a new one?
Scott
 

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The rear rim of the AT has a raised ridge at the bead area just like a tubeless rim, to keep the tire bead from slipping over when deflated, even though it's specifically not for tubeless use. The front rim is flat, no ridge. I'm assuming the difference is that you never want the rear tire to slip off the rim if it goes flat while riding. Putting power through the rear "could" make the tire squirm off a flat bead seat if it was deflated enough. Lose a rear tire at speed, you've maybe got your hands full. The front you can steer, so it doesn't matter as much.
I have seen allegations that tubeless tires are made to fit tighter at the bead than a similar tube-type, but I don't know if that's true. I have difficulty believing it. But I can tell you that the Anakee Adventures I have now are about the same effort to remove as the OEM Dunlops were. The rear involved much sweat and swearing, and the front I could take off with my hands, almost. But after a few years, tires generally harden up enough that I remove stubborn worn ones with a saber saw, by cutting the sidewalls around on both sides. The beads just fall off.
 

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Because of the front rim’s lack of ridge mentioned above, some people are hesitant to install a TL (tubeless) tire a conversion / sealed front wheel. A couple of years ago I sealed both my stock rims with the 3M tape and installed Ariete 90 degree valve stems. I then mounted a set of Shinko 705 TL tires front and rear. I have had absolutely no problems with that configuration. I only have 5k miles of roughly 50/50 paved/unpaved riding on the setup as this is only one of three bikes in the garage.

That said, the front rim was considerably more difficult to modify. I used narrower 3M tape (forget the actual width) and it was still more difficult to get the tape down into the spoke valley of the rim center. Also, because of the curved valley, I had to seal the valve stem to the rim with silicone sealant around the inside surface to ensure an airtight seal. The little rubber o-ring of the Ariete stem would not have sealed it.

I am of the opinion that airing down tires when going offroad does nothing, so leave my tires at nominal street pressures all the time. Airing down a front wheel modified this way might be a bad idea.

As for “safety”, a TT tire with a tube inside will generally deflate faster when punctured than a TL tire will. And both tires can fall off the rim when deflated, so I don’t see any added risk. Most punctures happen on the wider rear tire anyway, which does have the “safety“ bead on the rim. It is nice to just carry a plugging kit instead of spare tubes and tire irons.
 

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Because of the front rim’s lack of ridge mentioned above, some people are hesitant to install a TL (tubeless) tire a conversion / sealed front wheel. A couple of years ago I sealed both my stock rims with the 3M tape and installed Ariete 90 degree valve stems. I then mounted a set of Shinko 705 TL tires front and rear. I have had absolutely no problems with that configuration. I only have 5k miles of roughly 50/50 paved/unpaved riding on the setup as this is only one of three bikes in the garage.

That said, the front rim was considerably more difficult to modify. I used narrower 3M tape (forget the actual width) and it was still more difficult to get the tape down into the spoke valley of the rim center. Also, because of the curved valley, I had to seal the valve stem to the rim with silicone sealant around the inside surface to ensure an airtight seal. The little rubber o-ring of the Ariete stem would not have sealed it.

I am of the opinion that airing down tires when going offroad does nothing, so leave my tires at nominal street pressures all the time. Airing down a front wheel modified this way might be a bad idea.

As for “safety”, a TT tire with a tube inside will generally deflate faster when punctured than a TL tire will. And both tires can fall off the rim when deflated, so I don’t see any added risk. Most punctures happen on the wider rear tire anyway, which does have the “safety“ bead on the rim. It is nice to just carry a plugging kit instead of spare tubes and tire irons.
1 Wheel Drive,
I most certainly appreciate your comments and experience. As for airing down, well, the wife and I have been Jeepers for decades and have aired down each and every time any of our Jeeps have entered off road scenarios. In fact, I have a set of Staun deflators that are set to 10 psi for those Jeep tires. In 35+ years, I've never, ever broken a bead off a rim on any of our Jeep tires and wheels, goofing around off road.
As for airing down on a motorcycle, well, until recently, I've only done it on my Yamaha TW200. It's a fat tired little bike that with the street pressure of 20 psi in both, it rides like a little rock. For off roading, it's down to 4 psi in both. I have plenty of miles/months in off roading on that bike with that pressure, and never had any issue doing things that way.

As for the A/T and running low pressure, well, I don't get anywhere near the types of trails and ugly roads that I ride the TW on with the A/T. If the TW falls over, I can almost pick that 278 lb. bike up with one arm. But, if that big beast A/T - A/S - DCT falls over, I practically have to call for a crane. So, no, I won't be airing down THAT MUCH on the A/T. Maybe a few psi just to enhance the ride some but, that's it. I just received in the mail, my new little Dynaplug compressor that will be loaded up into the top box of the A/T for airing back up.
Scott
 

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I’m a Jeep guy too. Airing down a Jeep’s tires is a completely different situation, especially in soft sand or mud. Increasing the width of the contact patch can mean the difference between being stuck and driving out. We used to drive 4x4’s through the Cape Cod seashore park, and airing down was a requirement.

And running low pressures on a lightweight dirt bike is more of the same. Requires rim locks to get to pressure low enough to make the biggest gains.

Airing down the tires on a 500+ lb. ADV bike is asking for flat tires and bent rims. The tires (especially the skinny front) just aren’t large enough volume to support the weight of bike, rider and gear when you hit any kind of a sharp edged bump.

I have experimented with it and really do not feel any improvement in traction at 10-15 psi lower inflation, at least in the kind of dirt riding I do. You can’t realistically go any lower than that and keep the tires on the wheels.

But, as in most other things, “your mileage may vary”.
 

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Have over a year on my 18 ATAS tubeless front and rear with 3M 5200 marine sealant and 4412N sealing tape without issue. I've adjust pressure a few times for varying weather conditions and checked/tightened valve stem nuts slightly and that's it.

I applied the sealing tape on a wheel balancing stand and trimmed with a razor knife as I went around the rim. I did a double layer of sealing tape which I probably wouldn't do again as it just adds bulk to the drop center of the wheels which can make tire installation a bit more difficult and don't believe it adds any significant additional sealing benefit.

I went with NAPA NTH 90426 8.3mm straight valve stems, they are durable with thick rubber gasket and are tightened on the outside of the wheel which makes future tightening/adjustment possible without tire removal.

When installing the NAPA valve stem on tubeless sealing tape, it's best to use double (jam) the stem to hold and prevent the stem from twisting and disrupting the sealing tape while tightening. After installation I added a patch of sealing tape over the valve stem and trimmed around the valve stem to ensure the air hole was free.

Pic only shows one nut but comes with a pair.
Household hardware Nickel Cylinder Auto part Metal


The straight valve stems still have plenty of room to attach a tire gauge or adjust pressure and they are out of the way any potential damage, especially with valve cap TPMS installed. As has been mentioned, I'm not airing down the ATAS tires more than a few psi as the potential risk of wheel damage is too great.

Here are the wheels after tubeless install, with Dunlop Trailmax Mission tires mounted and tested for leaks in a tub of water, prior to balancing.

Wheel Tire Automotive tire Locking hubs Motor vehicle


The rear valve stems looks like there's a rubber gasket on the outside of the rim but it's just an optical illusion from the cone washer.

Tire Wheel Automotive tire Motor vehicle Locking hubs
 

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How do you like those TrailMax Mission tires? They look a lot more aggressive in your photos than the online photos I’d seen previously.
 
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